pointy-chinned girlie men / e-mail and comments / Angel / Sandman

[oiran]

So, I'm finally downloading all of the Yami no Matsuei vids from my streamload account, and I am missing (as I knew I was) episode #11. I have put off watching this, as I get the impression that I'm really going to like it, and I didn't want to get all embroiled in something new when I have so many old somethings still waiting for my attention. But, what the hell. If I'm going to have a muddled, overtaxed head anyway, I might as well do it on a grand scale.

Does anyone have episode #11 to share? According to the labeling on the eps I've got, this is part of the Kyoto arc. And are there more than thirteen episodes? I have 1-10, then 12 and 13.

You know, at one point, I told rhiannonhero that I really didn't understand the anime fandoms, and I still don't know that I understand the fandoms, per se, but I'm reading a little too much manga to pretend I'm above it all at this point.

Also, I am downloading what is apparently the entire run of Weiss Kreuz. I didn't check the file size and thought I was downloading, like, an episode, but so far I've got 2+ G downloaded of a 4+ G file...it's actually cooking along at quite a rapid pace, but since it's 4G, it's taking a few days. I'm attracted to this because 1) tynantblue0162 likes it, and she hasn't been wrong about shows yet, 2) hey, it's got pointy-chinned girlie-men!, and 3) they're florists. In case you haven't read one of my many exciting mentions of my upper-level schooling, such as it was, I decided to train as a florist a couple years back. I paid a lot of money to go to a lame school, spent nine months learning what I could have been told in a couple of bracingly direct weeks, and decided that I'd rather keep on loving flowers than make cheesetastic FTD arrangements for minimum wage. The notion that I might really like Weiss Kreuz and thus would have the chance to write porn with sexy FLORAL ARRANGEMENTS, even if they're only on the sidelines, gives me a happy, happy feeling.

~~~

Just a guilt-ridden PSA: I am still formulating replies to e-mail, comments and feedback received on or about my days (daze?) in New York. And the days since.

~~~

So Mr. Glove and I are watching Angel from the beginning now. We just started watching this past season, and basically had time enough to get completely hooked before it was snatched cruelly away. Watching S1, watching Doyle, and then watching Doyle die...gah! And then Wesley shows up and is all goofy comic-relief (the dancing! The terrible, terrible dancing!) and it made me cry because it changes so much, and in such a short time frame...

I'm not glad that Buffy is over, or that Angel is over, but I can't imagine how I'd cope had I watched the beginnings of these series in real time. Not only do I love butterfly's comments about both series, but her meta has a touch of stream-of-consciousness that really appeals to me. It's for posts like hers that I do wish I'd been part of the Buffy watchers all along.

Also, can anyone tell me why Doyle was axed so early? Was that something always planned, or did the actor have other things to do? Or was he just a schmuck? I really loved the character, and I loved the way he and Cordelia were becoming vulnerable for/to each other, and then...poof. Or, more like a sizzle, perhaps.

~~~

Finished the first two trades, Preludes and Nocturnes and The Doll's House. I've got to say, this is possibly the ugliest art in any book I've ever purchased, but I'm glad I got past that and into the text. The stories are...so good. Especially in The Doll's House. So for the dozen or so people who encouraged me to just try...thank you ;).

I understand there's Sandman fic...is any of it good? If so, I want recs!

Comments

[jukeboxromeo.livejournal.com]

I've got to say, this is possibly the ugliest art in any book I've ever purchased

Really? I liked the art in Preludes and Nocturnes. It was all kinds of creepy like which I think fit with the story line. Too each her own I guess :) Different artists illustrate difference books though, like in Season of Mists I found myself going, "whoa, when did Dream get so hot?" hehe.

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

I have very particular tastes in comic art, which has prevented me from enjoying the vast majority of it. It's been through LJ and the comic geek girls here that I've finally gone ahead and read some of the books I'd avoided until now due to disliking the art.

The creepiness seems very apt to me, too, but even within the chapters most of the artists are all over the place with the look of the characters. Inconsistency like that is something that bothers me in all comics and animation. I know how hard it is to draw a character consistently...but it isn't my paid job, you know? I like the art in my comic books to look meant. But then again, I only liked the looks of about a dozen titles ever, so I've clearly got issues.

Nonetheless, I'm going to finish reading the entire Sandman run. The stories are amazing, and the art doesn't bother me once I'm involved with the storylines.

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Doyle. Wow, that's a... rather painful question. I fell so hard and fast for Doyle when I started watching Angel. I stopped watching for the rest of season one after he died.

From what I've gathered (and I've read a lot about it), Glenn Quinn was abusing drugs and that's why he left the show. Joss maintains that killing Doyle was the plan all along, but there are strong indicators that that's not true. And GQ died young.

Secondly, I'm so thrilled that you enjoy my thoughts. I've been watching since the summer after first season of Buffy, so the world of Buffy and Angel feels like such a part of me. BtVS helped me survive clinical depression, to be frank about it. They're so much more than shows to me.

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

You know, now I remember there being talk about his death when I first got on LJ, but I'd never seen an episode of either Buffy or Angel at that point in time and I had no idea who he was. Your comment here made me do a moment's research, and now it all comes back to me. I feel kind of shitty for my flippancy above...

I loved Doyle. He was so charming and endearing, and even though I love Wesley (as he is in S1, and as he becomes later), I am feeling the loss of Doyle in the ensemble as I watch. It's a bit more awful now, thinking that he was probably doing everything in his life exactly wrong except those little bits that we saw onscreen.

I always heard how great the shows were, but I really didn't watch TV for years, and was very much a snob about it. I'd seen the Buffy movie and, while I liked it, it was hard to imagine it being sustainable over more than a couple of episodes, much less season after season. It was actually my friendship with stone_princess that led me to start watching the DVDs, as she was such a fan of the show. I'm really not interested in the slashy pairings that she likes, but I'm quite wholehearted about the shows generally.

I'm really glad that Buffy continues to have such an impact on "old" fans as well as new. It doesn't seem likely that people will stop thinking about the show any time soon, and I'm just happy to read along ;)

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

I read a quote about Glenn Quinn once... I can't remember the exact words, but it was something like -- he made everyone around him happy but couldn't ever manage the trick himself. I've seen drug abuse, and god -- the person I knew was much the same. She was so vibrant and just had this glow. She was gorgeous, even after you'd noticed the track marks on her arms. And she destroyed herself, because she was so incredibly unhappy. Drug abuse is often self-medication. She died in a closet from an overdose and wasn't found until after almost four days. That was my aunt.

It's a tragic and sadly not so uncommon story. Don't feel bad about being flippant. You didn't know the stories around his death, and you didn't say anything meant to be harmful to anyone. Thinking about Glenn and Doyle is sad for me regardless of context.

Doyle was such a great character. Losing him definitely warped and shifted the fabric of show -- made it darker. Doyle was many things, but he never was capable of breaking to the extent that Wesley did -- Doyle'd already had his dark moment of the soul and was on his way up. I'm very glad that his absence and his character have always been felt in the show. That they never forgot him.

And onto Buffy -- which pairings do you like? I'm generally a slasher by nature, but on BtVS, I've often adored the het couples (and, of course, my big OTP is the noncanon 'ship of Buffy and Xander).

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

I've been very surprised to find that I pretty much 'ship along canon lines in all the Joss shows. Even though I never liked Riley, I could see why Buffy did. I loved Willow with Oz, but I also loved how Tara's introduction as Willow's new partner took a long time, and the rest of the crew didn't just automatically care about and trust her. I'm still waiting on S6 and S7, though I have a pretty good idea about what will happen in the remaining episodes generally. I liked Buffy with Angel, but the ep between the two of them that affected me the most was the S1 Angel ep where they have the day together and Angel asks the Oracle to turn back time... I really do respond to the pairings much as though I'm witnessing the relationship changes and developments in the lives of real people, not fictional characters who can be forced into funny positions. The Buffyverse is one where I'm finding myself very content to see what "really" happens, and I don't want to fix things.

I simply don't see the slash between the male characters ever going beyond the stage of verbal jabs. While Angel and Spike get to be very much like an old married couple, they're not a sexually passionate old married couple, you know?

I am not opposed to the idea of Buffy/Faith, but I can't actually see Buffy going along with it ever. Faith - yes. Buffy - no. Drusilla/Faith intrigues me, but I don't feel like I've got enough knowledge of the 'verse to write it myself, though it's the only f/f pairing I can think of that seems like it might be fun to try.

The whole Spike/Xander thing is incomprehensible to me. That's what stone_princess tried to interest me in, and I know there are a ton of very accomplished and talented writers who are practically obsessed with the pairing...but I don't see it. Again, to me it's just snarking, not actual interest or passion.

Now, Buffy/Xander I could see, but I wouldn't want to put poor Xander through that. I liked Anya (and I know what happens, sort of, but please don't tell me any more!) and Xander together because she gave him an opportunity to be an authority, a leader, an expert. With Buffy, he was verging on being a worshipper, which might work for her...how did you see that relationship playing out?

[jack-pride.livejournal.com]

The whole Spike/Xander thing is incomprehensible to me. That's what stone_princess tried to interest me in, and I know there are a ton of very accomplished and talented writers who are practically obsessed with the pairing...but I don't see it.

As an obsessed S/X shipper, I've gotta say... I don't see it either. *g* The S/X slashy subtext on the show? Is practically non-existant. Really, I completely understand your reluctance; the pairing certainly lacks the onscreen eyefucks Clark and Lex seem to manage every. single. episode.

That said, I find that the characters - all canon aside - would fit really well together. I like to allow for a multitude of universes where the storylines permit S/X to find each other... while simultaneously enjoying Joss' canon universe where it's clear that it'll never happen. And, to be frank, I wouldn't *want* it to happen canonically, because I like my multitude of universes.

I'm starting to think that tv shows shouldn't give us relationships at *all*, just plenty of subtext. Because it never works out on the show how it should. *g*

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I don't really read too much BtVS fanfic, because the show satisfies many of my cravings.

The only pairings that worked for me, male-slash-wise have been Wes/Angel and Lindsey/Angel. And both of those are pretty unrequited, lust-wise.

And I totally agree re: Buffy/Faith. Faith wanted Buffy, but Buffy... I didn't ever see a sexual attraction to Faith.

And I don't get Spike/Xander at all, really. Doesn't work for me because they work off of different emotional scales.

re: B/X, it's... complicated. I know that the way I view their friendship is very different than how many people do -- I've seen hero worship with him, but he's not blind. He knows when she's screwed up and he's always willing to say so -- it's one of the things that pisses people off about him. He trusts her, believes in her, and follows her willingly. Unlike his relationship with Willow, he's not afraid to fight with Buffy because they have similar fighting methods -- they blow up and then it's okay again (Willow, on the other hand, sulks and holds grudges). Their fights would likely be spectacular, but once the fight was over, they'd be as solid as ever, as happened time and again in their friendship. Even during the fights, they're still loyal -- in the middle of one in Dead Man's Party, the second that danger crashes in, Xander has her back and Buffy trusts him to have it.

She is his hero, he's told us that himself. But I think he sees her on at least three levels -- hero, friend, and desirable woman.

My problem with his relationship with Anya is that I never really got the sense that he respected her as

re: Anya

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

My problem with his relationship with Anya is that I never really got the sense that he respected her as a person, not until the end of Season Six. And respect is a big issue with me -- it's why Angel/Lindsey breaks my heart (Angel has no respect for him).

There have been speculations

[nematoddity.livejournal.com]

Though initially it was announced as a possible drug overdose, later the fact that the family wanted the official determination sealed sparked many fan questions. There are rumors (unproven) of complications due to MS, sudden onset. But we're not sure. Nothing's clear, and I've done a lot of reading on it, too.

What we do have, on this end, is the solid thread of Doyle nostalgia running through the show. In fact, Charisma Carpenter's last episode this season featured the infamous Doyle commercial footage. It really shows Whedon's committment to his actors, for one thing.

I'm still angry over WB cancelling the show, frankly.

Re: There have been speculations

[butterfly.livejournal.com]

Yes, I love that they never forgot Doyle -- because I never forgot him. As late as season four, I was still saying that I couldn't ever love Wesley as much as I loved Doyle.

Well, now.

[nematoddity.livejournal.com]

Actually, Wes edged ahead on points fourth season, for the virtue of one line.

"I'll take away your bucket."

Wes as serious dom eclipsed Doyle as reluctant hero. He's still high on the list, for obvious reasons, but...damn. "I'll take away your bucket." Hee!

[boniblithe.livejournal.com]

I have episode 11.

You still need it? Can you file transfer?

I can try yousendit.com ...

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

I don't see why I couldn't file transfer... if you're willing to send it, I'd be thrilled to have it!

I just watched the ep that has the scene in your icon...I love Hisoka! I didn't think that I would, but I do. And when he's all tied up and cries out "Tsuzuki!" in that husky little voice...

I am deeply disturbed by Dr. Muraki, but he's just so...hot. And gay. And obsessive and evil. God.

[boniblithe.livejournal.com]

What's your AIM name?

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

VelvetClove - a 'c' not a 'g' I'll go sign on...

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

I'm having to go out...if you get this msg, I've set up to receive the file if you send it. Again, thank you ;)

[quixotic-sense.livejournal.com]

*waves* Hi. You don't know me, but you're on the flist of four other people I know. I occasionally read your LJ through serabut's flist anyway, and now that you've discovered Yami no Matsuei (and like Hisoka! Whee!)... well, I hope you don't mind me friending you. ^_~

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

Hee! Of course I don't mind! I've friended you back--and I hadn't realized that Margaret Cho had a blog, so I've found that through you--thank you.

I didn't expect to like Hisoka (an aversion to the oversized eyes, basically), but I was very affected when he was freaking out, not wanting Tsuzuki to touch him, but then explaining why. He just seemed so fragile, but trying to be so brave. Yeah. I like Hisoka ;) And just like I can get used to the unattractive art in the Sandman comics, I can adjust to the giant eyes in so much anime.

[quixotic-sense.livejournal.com]

That tension between a desire for strength and just sheer need drew me to Hisoka immediately. *grins* If you're interested, there are translated scans of the YnM manga floating around -- the art is very, very pretty. Though really almost stereotypically shoujo in the beginning, so I don't know if it'll appeal to you.

The stylized big eyes (all the better to be expressive with, my dear) aren't universal, though. If you're looking for shounen (boy's) anime with a large female following, try Slam Dunk. It's a classic sports anime. Very 80s/early 90s, very unself-consciously earnest, and has a very healthy sense of the ridiculous. ^_~ More recent (non-big-eyed) anime I'd recommend: Witch Hunter Robin, Twelve Kingdoms, Monster. I see you've been downloading Weiss Kreuz (woohoo!). It isn't all that much fun IMO until you're fairly familiar with anime cliches and the good stuff, but... yes. XD

[ranalore.livejournal.com]

I see Boni already took care of getting you Ep 11, so I'll just sit over here and hum with happiness at the possibility of you writing my pretty, dead boys.

[velvetglove.livejournal.com]

They are so damn darling. I thought I'd like it, but I didn't think I'd be so utterly charmed right away. And the fic possibilities seem pretty endless ;)

Pardon me for being pushy, but I get the impression you might have had ep 11 on offer? If so, I just tried to watch the copy of ep 5 I've got, but it has only audio, no video...and I don't speak Japanese, unfortunately. If you--or someone you know of--might have ep 5 for download, I'd really appreciate it.

[ranalore.livejournal.com]

I know the feeling well. Coyo mentioned she was into this new anime series, so I decided to dl the first ep and see what it was about. I'm not a fan of the anime style, so I had no idea I was going to fall in absolute and mad love, but I did.

I've got the fan subs of all thirteen episodes, so if you find you've got any problems with any of the others, just give me a shout and I'll be happy to send them to you.

[justblue0162.livejournal.com]

pimp

[justblue0162.livejournal.com]

p.s. i also liked poolhall junkies so maybe i'm not the one you want to turn to for new fandoms (although something tells me you will love schuldig!)